Thursday, December 9, 2010

Leaking Away (Updated)

Reading through the top story in today's The News and Jang, my eyes grew progressively wider and wider. Not so much from the latest Wikileaks revelations about India as from sheer incredulity.


 The News Karachi's front page today


Titled "Enough evidence of Indian involvement in Waziristan, Balochistan" (aside: how much is 'enough'?) in The News, the main story deals with a slew of information allegedly from US diplomatic cables sent from Delhi as well as other missions around the world about India. They confirm everything Pakistanis (or at least certain types of Pakistanis) always said about India: it's direct involvement of India in the anti-state activities in the Federally Administered Tribal Areas (FATA) and Balochistan, the weakness of the Indian dossier on Ajmal Kassab, the manipulated nature of Indian evidence about the ISI's involvement in the Mumbai attacks, the sissyness of India's generals who do things out of personal ego and petulance rather than well-thought-out strategy, the internal rifts in the Indian army, the similarity of the situation in Kashmir with that in Bosnia in the 1990s, the involvement of Indian intelligence in promoting Hindu extremists to conduct false flag attacks against India itself to implicate the ISI and Indian Muslims etc etc etc.


 Jang's front page today

But I think where my incredulity reached a tipping point was when the cables claimed well regarded Indian policeman Hemant Karkare - who had been following leads about the involvement of Indian right-wing Hindutva organizations in the Samjhota Express bombing and about whose death there has already been plenty of controversy within India - was "eliminated in a pre-planned ambush during the Mumbai attacks", the implication being 'by the covert operatives of the Indian army.' According to the report in The News:


"The cable suggested that Hemant Karkare held a secret meeting with a senior US diplomat in New Delhi during the national day reception of a friendly country and briefed him about the gravity and the growing depth of the nexus between top Indian Army leadership and the militant Hindu fanatic groups. Karkare sought security for him and his family from the said American diplomat as he feared that the army and establishment would eliminate him as he intended to move further to expose the network. He had further briefed the said US diplomat that a former commander-in-chief of the Central Command of the Indian army, Lt Gen PN Hoon, was heading the militancy wing of the Hindu extremists and was getting full tactical, logistic and financial support from senior army officers. The day, Karkare was eliminated in a pre-planned ambush during the Mumbai attacks, a cable sent to the US read “we have lost an important link and a vital evidence”."
 

This was HUGE. This was BEYOND huge! Surely the world would be going mad with this new revelation!

Imagine my bewilderment then, when I turned to other papers and discovered that there seemed to be no mention of this story anywhere in any other Pakistani paper... not Dawn, not Express Tribune, not the Daily Times et al (Okay, so The Nation and Nawai Waqt did have it, but who believes anything they run?). Did the Jang Group and Majid Nizami's vanity projects just scoop everyone else? So I went online to check the Indian papers. No mention. Cowards. But what was really strange was that I couldn't seem to find these incredibly incriminating cables anywhere on the Guardian Wikileaks website or even mentioned anywhere in a Google News search.

In fact, the only other place which seemed to have the story were those redoubts of journalistic integrity, Rupee News and the Daily Mail Post type sites. Ah. And this absurd plant is your top story, Jang Group? Really?

Small wonder The News and Jang give the source of the report as "Agencies."

Question: How stupid do the "Agencies" really think Pakistanis are?


: : : UPDATE : : : 

So, the Express Tribune did in fact run a similar story. On page 8. Datelined Washington and sourced from the wire agency Online. I had mistakenly thought they had had better sense but it seems they didn't have much faith in the revelations to put them on the front page or somewhere else more prominent. Which of course begs the question, then why run them at all?

Incidentally, here is a link to the cheerleader Ahmed Quraishi's page, making the most of his imagination. And here is the Daily Mail Post basking in his reflected glory. Thanks to @Rezhasan and Shahid Saeed for the links.


114 comments:

Emad said...

Haha well articulated. I've been trying to make sense of the same thing all morning, scouring Guardian, NYT and Wikileaks for a source. What shit.

Anonymous said...

Good post! I am surprised that the mature press in pakistan believes that blaming India for everything is going to help!

WhoamI said...

"In fact, the only other place which seemed to have the story were those redoubts of journalistic integrity.."
Epic..I likey..ROFL
Information operations are so ridiculous.About time,Pakistanis petition GHQ to fire their psychological operations' chief.

Mumra said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Mumra said...

I dont get the point. There is a very VERY good chance that all of Wikileaks' cables are false - I don't really believe in written/documented evidence unless its scanned. The only INTEL that counts is voice and video - which has to be vetted and proofed.

But if one accepts Wikileaks' cables (self-formatted and aggressively hosted as they are) for the truth - as I'm sure most media outlets are doing, and not only in Pakistan - then they still remain impressions, interpretations and assessments of US diplomats. Even what one General said or did, or what one politician said or did, is relayed in these cables IN TERMS OF A US DIPLOMAT WHO WROTE THE ALLEGED CABLE. Gossip gossip gossip.

Undoubtedly, WikiLeaks has become another media organization, and when the media is unrestrained and irresponsible, one can surely see a cycle of self-repetition and self-referencing rather than objective reporting. If you refer to something that isn't real, then you're obviously building (or trying to build) a superstructure of steel on nothing but thin air.

If there's one thing Pakistan's media has taught me, it is that Sensationalism (with a capital S) is a must. And one cannot look at the favourable leaks while ignoring the unfavourable ones - goes without saying. The latter helps you appear more balanced and truthful :p

Also, FYI, GHQ does not have a PsyOps Chief - ISI does, at the rank of Major General, and he has indeed been replaced last month. But this has more to do with propaganda subterfuge than psychological warfare - Pakistan's media is well accustomed to conduction (and responding to) PsyOps.

mcphisto said...

I have a feeling that they managed to decrypt the 256-bit encryption and they have what the world does not.

Rehan said...

Well Said @Mumra

And you the guys behind "Cafe Pyala": All you can do is to criticize everyone just to gain some fame out of.. Come on guys..take a break and do something constructive !!
You are not serving any purpose here !!!

Tayyab Mahmood said...

@Mumra & Rehan...
my dear ignorant Pakistanis please bear in mind that till now Americans haven't denied the cables & also your beloved Generals not retracted these cables so how can you ???
also we are used to this kind of shit from our media. now a dayz its working as mouth piece of Establishment (Army + ISI).. did u notice in last night's Capital Talk Hamid Mir removed / edited Khawaja Asif's (PMLN) comments which were about Malik Riaz of Bahria town regard the sending of media personals on hajj also incurring fine of 9 million. except Dawn News no other media report any irregularity abut Bahria town.

Anonymous said...

Question: How stupid do the "The News & Jang" really think Pakistanis are?

Mumra said...

@Tayyab Mahmood: my dear fellow Pakistan, please correct YOUR ignorance and refer to how DG ISPR relayed the news about General Kayani saying he respects all Pakistani politicians. Yeh lo apne pasandeeda DAWN News ki zubaani: http://www.dawn.com/2010/12/05/army-didn-t-plan-coup-says-ispr-kayani-respects-politicians.html . Please note that the first line of the DAWN News staff reporter claims this to be an "official response" of the Pak Army to Wikileaks.
You call the media "mouthpiece of the establishment" whenever you want, and whenever you want, it becomes "mouthpiece of the awam". Tell me, is the government also in cahoots with the establishment, with the very same ISI that Pres Zardari claimed in a Wikileak cable wants to "take him out"? Apni aqal ko haath maro yaar. Isn't DAWN, the mouthpiece of saaf safai and unbiased reporting on corruption, also part of this monolithic media machine that you yourself state a few lines above as "mouthpiece of the establishment"? I reiterate, aqal ko haath maro.

@mcphisto: there is one 1.4GB insurance file that has still not been decrypted. THAT file will be opened with a password, which will be revealed in case Julian Assange dies, or wishes it to be revealed. THAT leak is gonna be the Pandora's box.

FM said...

Good post CPM. I can't bear The News and Geo anymore and have stopped reading/watching, but thanks to your work (also XYZ's excellent post on Kamran Khan's show a few days back) can stay informed about the new depths they keep sinking to. Media monitoring stories like these -- and the one about the agencies' online publications -- are the real strength of Cafe Pyala.

Magnum said...

LOL! Well piecked. But no matter how hard one keeps kicking all the fascist punks at jang, News and nawa-e-waqt, the truth is their balls are not where they're supposed to be. They're in their heads. Thus, really don't want to get into where their brains are.

Magnum said...

@Rehan
"Come on guys..take a break and do something constructive !!"

Err ... like what shoud CP do to be constructive? Covolute info and turn it into utter lies so that 'patriots' (read washed idiots) like you can feel good?

Learn to seperate the chalk from the cheese, fool. No wonder this country's been eating chalk for so long. Go read one of those fake sites put there by Zaid Hamid bozos (and bimbos) if you want ... errm ... constructive. Very constructive lies, indeed.

Anonymous said...

Cafe Pyala walay sarkar, you are raising my curiosity by deleting comments... what are they about, dude?

I think there should be a new blog for the deleted comments... Oh, freedom of the press!

Anonymous said...

Jang-The New-GEO have a long history of unethical journalism ... we have seen it over and over again. They are quite capable of inventing ... cooking up ... artificially creating news. In this, they have learnt a lot from their god-fathers ... Fox ... Murdoch owned media ... and the Indian media-Corporate India ... . Their only principle is Money ... so, whatever sells ...

As for the reality behind Hemant Karkare's murder, the truth behind Bombay incident and the growing communal terror in India ... is gradually coming out ...

12 said...

Let me go off track here and you let you that "begs the question" does not mean "asks the question" or "leads to this question". please search that term.

Aziz said...

who the fuck is mumra?

Dawar said...

LOL @ Aziz!!
Maybe someone at The News/Geo/Jang?

Mamra. Sounds kind of weird, if you know what I mean.

Bolshevik said...

Dawar, Wasn't Mamra some Thunder Cats character? Also, boobies aren't "weird".

Anonymous said...

on the whole are-they-true-or-are-they-untrue debate regarding the authenticity of the wikileaks cables, i personally think that there's only a kernel of truth in the cables.. they're not entirely true and not entirely untrue.. they are after all a diplomats opinion on some event.. its bound to be exaggerated..

and to those who think this all this blogging and debating is not constructive, please define the notion of political awakening among the youth for me.. i'll be appropriately grateful

Anonymous said...

The important question is:
"Who benefits or who suffers from fanning the flames of distrust between Pakistan and India?".

Bolshevik said...

Also, notice how The News ki story, which appeared today (Dec 9) quotes this story, which was posted YESTESRDAY (Dec 8) on RupeeNews almost verbatim.

Bolshevik said...

Business Recorder: http://www.brecorder.com/news/latest/16603:india-has-terror-tentacles-in-balochistan-waziristan-wikileaks.html

Tayyab Mahmood said...

hey guys take it down a notch :)

& Let's have a toast for the douchebags, A** H***,scumbags, every one of them we know Let's have a toast to the jerkoffs because they'll never take work off.......

http://bit.ly/fcsmuI

mehboob said...

Does anyone have any link to an actual cable with this information? even the otherwise sane dunya news is running with the story.. please give link to the cable if anyone has it..

Bolshevik said...

They don't exist.

ayyo said...

its sad and unfortunate that Pakistani press, in its blinkered view of India can stoop to reporting concocted news about India as screaming headlines.

are we indians saying it ? no! please read http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/dec/09/pakistani-newspaper-fake-leaks-india

sad and unfortunate that blind hatred and prejudice is being fueled by such startling yellow journalism
regards
indian

Tayyab Mahmood said...

wow pyala you are also in the Guardian story by Declan Walsh, he end the story with following...

"the blogger Cafe Pyala asked: "How stupid do the 'Agencies' really think Pakistanis are?""

& people like "mumra" & "rehan" covers the stupid part :)

majid maqsood said...

i do not understand why people think there is nothing such leakage in wiki leaks which leads embarrassment for India? its very simple to understand, their rulers and army do not draw power from USA and their economy is so strong. they dont need to behave like us, they do not need of Kerry-loger or any such assistance which may be oxygen for country. we people are totally dependent on USA,and we cant move an inch without the permission of USA, its not amazing but its fact America Operates our country and we are not independent. i dont blame to USA but we have yet not emerged as a Nation on Globe, we dont have National spirit and we dont want to support any good thing in the country, if one democratic Govt does any thing good for the people, the new Govt stops it, they dont think for the country but they think, their last govt does not get any credit. we have never strengthened our institutions but we always try to strengthen personalities. India is a big market and they talk with USA face to face on bilateral benefits, but Pakistani leaders do not have such capacity by virtue of our country. People were in false happiness that our army is independent and organized institution but now wikileaks has given all details and exposed our army leadership and how they talk to USA for toppling the democratic govt but you cant expect such things in India, All dictators were supported by USA and people of Pakistan did not do any thing, we Pakistani only abuse USA but when they support dictators, people dont react but also support dictators and it leads destruction of institutions. many agreements are done with USA without concern of people of Pakistan but only one dictator makes and deals all agreement who does not think for the country and he does all things in his personal favor. its very easy to blame India and USA but now people understand, its simply to shift own responsibilities and failure. Wickileaks has made a big issue for USA but our people are saying it conspiracy of USA. we never admit facts.

Anonymous said...

Payalawala sahib,

You are famous. I just got to your site from guardian.

Nice piece.

The statement starting with "Enough evidence" is enough proof of Pakistnized angreezi in the cable. Its hardly a proper term for something of this magnitude.

Anonymous said...

Ha...at least we have a new name for coining such leaks...(Ladies and) Gentlemen, welcome PAKILEAKS !!!

Indian said...

Wow. Give these guys the Pulitzer already. :-)

Sunny said...

And here I thought only the media on this side of the border have a tendency to blame every shitty things happening here on the other side and ISI.

A: "Hey my dog did not shit today"
Media: "This is done by ISI"

Personally,
Glad to see that not all of the people on the other side of the border are idiots to fall for such cheap tricks.

I wrote the "other side of the border" so often that I don't like the phrase any more.

Cheers,
Sunny

Anonymous said...

Wait, are you saying Pakistan's media is unreliable?

Sunny said...

@Anonymous:
Do you rely on any other media? Media can always amplify things and make a statement too deceiving. It is not restricted to only Pak media. #Sadbuttrue

Vivek said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Anonymous said...

Looks like Pakistanis learned the art of deception from the British before independence. Careful with it, though. You don't want to be as untrustworthy as the British.

Anonymous said...

whoever is this murra
most of the truth was known by people that was exposed by wikileaks
n they only fragmented the whole scenario n told what exactly happened
n abt asshole press n electronic media ,they dont have any work except to make fake news to make the people remember that they are the most "suffered" person in the world n the reason is only india.
better media shd mind over own government n their wikileaks exposed despite of india

Lughole said...

Dude, congrats for being on the Guardian website. Its weird when Indian twitterati are fighting the Indian media for objectivity and balance, we get to hear of this stupidity from across the border. Thanks to people like you, some sanity prevails and questions are asked. I'm glad Dawn did not publish these stories, its one paper from Pakistan I hold in high esteem.

Btw, if Pakistanis want to join in the Indian protests against shoddy journalism, use the twitter hash tag #dalalmedia

Check out the real time tweets here - http://twitter.com/#!/search?q=%23dalalmedia

Anonymous said...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/dec/09/pakistani-newspaper-fake-leaks-india

Ajith, Bangalore said...

This is such a brilliant piece of work! I'm an Indian and I'm not gonna be the usual lets-bash-our-neighbour type - the sort of benevolence of Indian generals/politicians portrayed in Indian media (on account of Wikileaks) is an absolute farce. So as common citizens who are sensible/educated enough to read the article, lets just take a step back and wonder: so who's taking whom for a ride here? How many people are cashing in on 'our' so called 'rivalry'? No, chuck those bhai-bhai calls. All we need is peace. The rest will fall in place.

Cheers!

Anonymous said...

utter waste of news print. At least check authenticity before publishing such articles. If this is the view of people running national media then India and Pakistan will always remain enemies. Editors should be put behind bars for publishing such stories which harm international relations and shows the country in bad light.

Nadir El-Edroos said...

Well Zafar Hilaly has taken the bait

http://tribune.com.pk/story/87983/no-conspiracy-theories-please/

Air said...

I'm going to tell that poor tribune guy...

Anonymous said...

Zafar Hilaly just made my day. His name is now etched in the eternal book book of "Crappy Pakistani Media" factoids! I LOVE THIS GUY for taking the bait. Not only did he take it, he ran with it. The sheer stupidity is awesome.

Yay!!!!

Anonymous said...

Such articles are perfect examples of the art of deceit..I mean come on, is the paki media so controlled by the "Agencies".. the credibility of both the "agencies" and paki media sure has gone down the toilet... this is not to say that media in any region functions absolutely freely from state interference, but this I believe is the nadir or the lows.

On the other hand, events such as these are nothing new.. the fact that pakis learn history from doctored history textbooks (eg. Pakis are arabs.. etc) is accepted, by other more sensible paki scribes and public figures.

I sure hope you guys rise above all this BS and work hard to develop your otherwise crumbling economy.

Best regards,
Another Indian.

Anonymous said...

Just a somewhat personal question. Did you, 'Cafe Pyala' eat more vegetables than your fellow Pak friends did, in childhood?

Just wondering(seriously). Thanks very much for this post - it is a relief to know that it is not all twilight zone on the other side. -Concerned Indian.

Anonymous said...

Hi,
I am an Indian and really find this hilarious, I am not trying to put down anyone infact the Indian media is no better the journalists in India are like middlemen trying to make deals with corporations and politicians its high time responsible jornalism takes place anything that happens in India is related to pakistan and anything that happens in Pakistan is related to India its high time the general public of India and Pakistan woke up and see reality rather than from some moronic journalists

Anonymous said...

please do read these on wikileak website
http://213.251.145.96/cable/2008/11/08ISLAMABAD3716.html
last part of first (summary) paragraph

http://213.251.145.96/cable/2010/02/10ISLAMABAD399.html
last part of the second paragraph

Anonymous said...

Paki-leaks

Anonymous said...

yet another Indian. Chennai, this time.
.
Nice to read some sane voices from the 'Land of the Pure'. Wonder if you'll consider this land (on your other side) as 'Land of the Impure / Dirty / Kufar'?
.
Proud Kafir - Idolator - Polytheist - but first & foremost - HUMAN BEING - and next, a Dravidian (Race-wise).
.
MN

Anonymous said...

you are on the guardian : http://www.thenews.com.pk/TodaysPrintDetail.aspx?ID=2549&Cat=13

Anonymous said...

pyala darling..getting lots of hits after the Guardian moment.. sweet

Sagar said...

Isn't this the same group that promotes 'Aman ki Asha' jointly with Times of India. Wonder why only Asha (hope) and why not actual Aman itself? And how can someone claiming to promote 'Aman' call themselves the 'Jang' group? Strange paradox.

Anonymous said...

yet another Indian

it's not the first time Pakistani media which is no more than a mouthpiece of ISI-Army nexus has thrown its weight to pent up anti-India feelings in the minds of average Pakistani, but it's heartwarming for me to read the comments over here which clearly state that Pakistanis aren't fools and know the difference between artificial jingoism and informed view of their country.

May your country be freed from evil nexus of ISI and Military (and not to forget media houses like Jung) which are coming in between us two great nations.

Jai Hind!!

Anonymous said...

Very true and brave writeup my friend......I am from India and I agree that there are differences between us.Guys I would like to point out that similar sort of differences are between India and China but the 2 countries are committed for there people development instead of indulging in cross-fighting.

Once again I appreciate your neutral view and hope that this will thrash all people who want to increase hatred in innocent people's heart.

From Isloo said...

Loved NFP's Tweet on this one:

"Jang,News & Nawa-e-Waqt publish fake Wikileaks abt India. Yup, faking orgasms have always been their specialty. Sirs, your flies are open."

LOL. Btw, Pyala people, you rock.

Kabir said...

Having grown up with a lot of Pakistani friends in Dhaka and then Singapore, I have been following the news in your country with great sadness over the last few years. I cannot say how happy I am to find this blog, and I'm glad the Guardian publicized it. All the Pakistanis I have known were intelligent, thinking people, which is certainly not the impression that the media in the country is projecting! (same can probably be said about India too). Will definitely be following cafe pyala. Keep up the good work!

-Kabir, Delhi

Aditya said...

Having come across sites like rupeenews.com, I always thought there have to be people saner than those running sites like rupeenews, that surely not everybody in Pakistan (or Pakistani media actually) must be so hateful about India. Well, your blog is the evidence, And it's a relief.

Anonymous said...

Prabhu, Chennai
Good to see people are sensible enough to see what is true and what is a lie.
Keep up the good work..

Anonymous said...

The Guardian story has been picked up by NDTV, but sadly make no mention of CP.
http://www.ndtv.com/article/india/pakistan-fakes-wikileaks-against-india-71686?

S2 said...

hello cpyala..Don't know whether u know this but in the ahmed quraishi page,the web editor has put up a clarification

"Web Editor says:
December 10, 2010 at 3:53 am

The Guardian newspaper is claiming this report is ‘fake’. Here is why you should disregard Guardian’s claim for being biased:

WikiLeaks is not saying this. UK’s Guardian newspaper is. It’s one of 4 or 5 newspapers that have been selectively… releasing the Wiki cables. About 1,200 have been released so far out of 251,000 or so. Guardian and others have manipulated the leaks to release material that supports US policy on Pakistan, specifically on Pakistani nukes and Pak policy on Afghanistan, India and Kashmir. Now there is this story and The Guardian is horrified that there is someone else practicing manipulation besides us. All I can say is that substantial parts of the story in Pakistani media is correct. It’s only that The Guardian & Co. are misleading the world public opinion by selective focus on the things they want. So here is WikiLeaks doing a good job of exposing US bully diplomacy, and here comes NYT, Guardian and 2 or 3 other ‘partner’ newspapers of WikiLeaks to selectively release the material to suit US policy objectives."
http://www.ahmedquraishi.com/2010/12/08/wikileaks-leak-about-india-israel-and-afghanistan/

Pyalanamma said...

There has been a lot of talk as to why the people behind this stunning blog are. A lot has been speculated about this. The usual culprits, if I may call them that (endearingly, though), are the ones which I will name as well.

I will be providing proof soon. But mind you, I am doing this only because it is about time the Pyala folks should get credit for the numerous stories and analysis they have broken in exposing all these unethical journos, TV anchors, channels and newspapers.

I have on good authority that the three main people behind Pyala are Hassan Zaidi, who’s a film-maker and of the Kara Film Festival; Muhmmad Hanif, journalist and author of Case of Exploding Mangoes; and NFP (Nadeem F. Paracha), the sarcastic Dawn columnist and (according to his twitter profile), a ‘militant liberal.’

There was also talk that there maybe a fourth, but I am not sure. What say you?

TLW said...

Dear Indians-With-Mildly-Surprised-And-Not-At-All-Condescending-Comments

Patronise Much?

In other news, we learnt that there are a *lot* of Indians reading the Guardian, and Cafe Pyala can really drive up it's readership if more mainstream news websites link to it.

And Indians learnt that there is a group of Pakistanis on the interwebs taking apart their own media's spin, and government's propaganda, 24/7. And surprise, surprise, We happen to be human and not Bollywood caricatures.

You folks should *Lurk Moar* here.

Cafe Pyala is the original Pakileaks.org

Manuel said...

Hey, you are right, its all fake. Guardian has a link back to your blog. Congrats for this bold reporting. http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/dec/09/pakistani-newspaper-fake-leaks-india

TLW said...

Oh wow, Pyalanama sez the people behind Cafe Pyala are Mohammad Hanif, NFP and Hasan Zaidi.

It would be awesome if two of my literary idols, and a Pakistani cinematographic lucky charm are behind CP, but I doubt I would be that lucky.

Still, maybe Pyalanama is uttely BS'ing and the Pyala people have let the post go as a sort of red herring to divert people's attention from their *real* identities. Although it has to be asked, are NFP and Mohammad Hanif *that* reclusive that they can have three different personalities (a personal identity, a literary one, and one for Cafe Pyala) running?

The plot thickens.

Oh, and my two paisa are that one of the posters on Pyala is a woman.

Some people suspected Faiza S Khan, but I'm not sure.

Toodles.

Pyalanamma said...

I am convinced it is these three TLW. I've heard from so many people. I sure hope I am not bullsh^^thing, though. All roads lead to Hassan, NFP and Hanif. The fourth one I think is Shandana Mehnaz, I hope I got her spelling right. :)

Anonymous said...

well you got hasan zaidi's spelling wrong, so that's not a good start...

Jay S said...

Mind-boggling con job with screaming 1-inch headlines ! How did the 'leading' media buy this story? I mean, don't they ever whet their stories? Imagine another planted story by the ISI saying 'India move nukes near Pak border'. It could very well start a nuke war. Amazing!!

Anonymous said...

These are not WIKILeaks, they are PAKILeaks :)

Anonymous said...

Don't want to continue to be patronising but what proportion of Pakistanis do you think WANTS to believe in the ISI version of Wikileaks, and hence will?

'Ideology of Pakistan' is like religious faith - public skepticism about it can go only as far as the state's guardians, ie, ISI and blasphemy law, respectively allow. - Concerned Indian.

Anonymous said...

PS: I mean, if the Urdu newspapers which published versions of yesterday's article also apologised then that would be truly remarkable.

Anonymous said...

Occasional posts by Omar R. Qureshi, the frustrated editorial pages incharge at ET and Talat Aslam, the editor of The News.

Abrams said...

What I found really funny is the part bout where Hemant Karkare is said to have a meeting with a senior US diplomat. I realise that in Pakistan everybody from the top (i.e., Army Chief) right down to the President frequently confide to the US ambassador to gain mileage. And I guess the guys who concocted this news dint quite figure why it would be any different in India. Little do these charlies know that in India, nobody gives a damn to the US Ambassador! But cant blame the inventive charlies cos they created news that their intended audience would eagerly lap up.

Bolshevik said...

What's with all the uber-condescending input from our Indian sistren and brethren?

*Begin rant*
Darlinks, you make it sound like Pakistan is the only fucked up place in the world! And while there's no denying that it IS incredibly fucked up, you lot are pissing even ME off, despite my zero tolerance for idiotic bourgeois notions of 'patriotism'.

You're forcing me to drag out the unrest (and the inhuman crackdown, which, by the way, is still underway) in Kashmir, the North-east, Assam, and the Adivasi belt, to name a few; AND the recent Radia tapes waalah monkey-business and subsequent attempts at cover-ups by the corporate media (Oh thank heavens for Manu Joseph and the minority of independent journalists that he represents!); AND the entire list of pro-Establishment journos in the Indian media; AND so much more!

Damn you lot, stop being so patronising, and understand that as Southasians, we're all incredibly and almost equally fucked up. Jeez!

*end rant*

Anonymous said...

Daily Times recently published 3 articles in which Hemant Karkare was projected as one of the 10 terrorists who attacked Mumbai. Ajmal Kasab was described as someone picked up by Indians in Nepal or elsewhere and framed for the attacks by Indian intelligence to malign the ISI.

http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2010\11\20\story_20-11-2010_pg3_3


The reason for so much talk about Hemant Karkare is the Samjhauta Express bombing. Just think of the implications if, as the US apparently believes, the Samjhauta Express bombing was arranged by ISI simply to give the then Pak govt(headed by Musharraf, with the ISI headed by Kiyani) equal-equal talking points about terrorism in India.

The fake narrative on Hemant Karkare is thus compelled by a need cover up the links between Lashkar(and ISI) to the Samjhauta bombing.

( In July 2009 US linked a Lashkar guy Arif Qasmani to the Samjhauta bombing.

http://www.longwarjournal.org/archives/2009/07/us_sanctions_pakista.php )

Any number of Indians' mea culpas about any subject cannot change this horrible fact.

sadhanag said...

Corr:
The fake narrative on Hemant Karkare is thus compelled by a need to cover up the links between Lashkar(and ISI) and the Samjhauta bombing.
-Concerned Indian

Anonymous said...

@Bolshevik - I understand why you are pissed off, but let's try to objective about this - the matter at hand is something that went wrong in Pakistan and the resulting comments reflect that. Let's, all of us, go to OutlookIndia (re: Nira Radia tapes) and say something about how the media in India is fucked up, there.

This blog entry is related to how journalism in Pakistan is all messed up and therefore one should expect comments (from Indians and non-Indians alike) saying just that.

Bolshevik said...

@Anon924:

This blog entry is related to how journalism in Pakistan is all messed up and therefore one should expect comments (from Indians and non-Indians alike) saying just that.

True, but if you don't see the completely condescending nature of most of the comments from 'anonymous concerned Indian(s)', then you really DON'T understand why I'm pissed.

Tilsim said...

Stopped reading Jang decades ago. Stopped watching GEO and other such nonsense from this group years ago.... in disgust at their mind games, hypocrisy and lack of balance. Advise others do the same.

Tayyab Mahmood said...

@Bolshevik well said bro... your rant was good :)

Bolshevik said...

Tayyab Mahmood: I'm not a man. And your assumption wasn't sexist at all.

Anonymous said...

I am an Indian and I not at all feel "oh, these pakis - they will never change".

Just kidding. That is exactly how I feel.

Hahahahhahahhaha! Heehehhhhee!
My tummy hurts! Hahahahha!

(Cafepyala or no cafePyala, few hipster-uber-cool-sane-western educated pakis among utterly insane 170 million does not change matters much. Thanks for the laughs, though!)

Tilsim said...

@ bolshevik

Can't agree with you more. I have a positive view of India and Indians but the comments on many on Pakistani blogs have been an eye opener. I don't like how many of them interact on Pakistan topics or with us on blogs - comments in general reflect hostility and ignorance rather than honest enquiry, sympathy, empathy or the seeking of common ground. What a shame to lose this opportunity to build a better cyber reality between the two nations. Same old hostilities now being created in cyber space. Losers.

Anonymous said...

I'm Indian. And utterly appalled by the immaturity of my countrymen.

Good to see some brilliant citizen journalism happening in Pakistan. Vaya con dios!

Anonymous said...

Tilsim -
pakis have made land for mohammedans by cleansing everyone else.
And you expect empathy and sympathy for that. Why am I not surprised?

Here is a thought. If cafePyala-ism sweeps pakiland, sanity is restored and in next fifty years you have 30% thriving non-muslim pupolation in pukkatland, you will not be complaining that there is no empathy for ummah; how's that?

Till then, we shall laugh at pakis and have fun.

Anonymous said...

@Bolshevick:
you forgot to mention maoists and the local naxal violence.. even our PM and Home minister have admitted that the biggest internal threat to the country are maoists and naxalites.. NOT the Indian Mujahideen and its like..
agree with your rant completely otherwise (yes i am Indian. i apologize for the condescension from my fellow country people.. for what its worth, check out this post by kalakawa: http://kalakawa.wordpress.com/2010/08/06/geo-political-theatre/

Indians do have this nasty tendency of taking themselves too seriously.. i'm working on my own issues regarding that.. but sadly most Indians are in denial about this problem!)

sadhanag said...

Well sure, Indians will move on to the problem of Pakistanis being pissed at their comments once Indians are done dealing with the problem of getting blown up at home by Pak terrorists.

Someone pl. call Bolshe's mommy :)

Bolshevik said...

Anon1157: I clubbed them together under the 'Adivasi belt' waali heading. :-) I disagree with the bit the Maoists being a bigger threat, though -- resolve the grievances of the tribal belt, and the Maoists will lose much of their support base. Meanwhile, I don't blame people for looking to them for help -- if you unleash the Salwa Judum on a people, they are bound to retaliate or seek help, non? Plus, from what I know, there are more 'peaceful' Adivasi movements than armed ones, but those are being forced into a corner, thanks to the corporate-political nexus.

Bolshevik said...

Sadhanag, I can only smile at your simple-mindedness and inability to gauge nuance in an argument. For the record, most of my immediate family is Indian.

Akshay said...

Fucking genius! I linked to this blog from The Guardian Website, and I must say this is the ONLY balanced, sceptical, and critical assessment of current affairs I've ever come across. I have very little knowledge about Pakistani public life but the few articles on Indian issues are of the calibre I wish the douchebag journalists here would reproduce. No beating around the bush, no taking sides, no meaningless nationalism. THIS is real journalism.

You have a fan!

sadhanag said...

Bolshie
So what? If online comments are the worst of your problems you are a very lucky person unlike some Indian getting blown up because the ISI thinks it worthwhile to do so while the US regards the same ISI as its major ally against terrorism.

Anonymous said...

Hi,
Did any of the three newspapers provide a retraction of this story, in today's paper. I searched, but I found nothing.

Thanks,

V

Anonymous said...

Hi,
This is the same anonymous as above. I found the retractions at http://thenews.com.pk/TodaysPrintDetail.aspx?ID=2574&Cat=13
and at
http://tribune.com.pk/story/88268/pakistani-media-fake-wikileaks-cables-attacking-india-published/
Nothing in the Nation Though.
No mention of CapePyala.

Thank you,
V

Anonymous said...

Hi,
this is the last time I will comment here, but the agencies' wordplay on Pyala/Payola was too much to ignore.

http://rupeenews.com/2010/12/09/passage-to-india-delhi-supporting-baloch-terrorists/

V.

TLW said...

if online comments are the worst of your problems

They aren't, but thank you for your overflowing cup of mercy.

you are a very lucky person unlike some Indian getting blown up

If you think Indians getting blown up are the "worst of your problems", then you live in a sad scared world.

TLW said...

In more important news, if Shandana Minhas is a member of Cafe Pyala, then I have to say that's a three out of four really awesome team. I loved her writings, especially when she wrote on violence in Karachi and how the Clifton/Sea View lot were reacting to it. I devoured those stories as a preteen.


There is one particular short story that of hers, involving a girl, her seven younger brothers and her father, that read like horror and black comedy combined. You could tell by the description of the stories settings, that it was placed in a Sea View apartment across from Clifton Beach.

If it is Shandana Minhas who writes for Cafe Pyala, I want to say ♥♥♥`s and thank you for helping me cope with Karachi in the very late nineties and real early 2000`s.

This is straight from the heart.

|»TLW«|

harris said...

Thanks to fake Wikileaks, I came accross this blog. Sanity does prevail among some Pakistanis! As I understand Islam is about truth and honesty, rarely practised in the Islamic Republic. Only 2 papers have offered apologies, if they want to be real journalists they should investigate who was behind planting the story. Spin doctors will be still busy saying the authenticity of the story. ISI is the holy cow in Pakistan, anybody can hardly speak against it, except A. Q. Khan(who is the most respected person in Pakistan), but his opinion was hardly reported in Pakistani media.
Transparency, independent honest free press, tolerance, secularism, multiculturism are essential for vibrant democracy. Propogandists, religious extremists and spin doctors should be discouraged in democracy. May be one day Pakistan will mature will have true journalists and real history books. Ameen!

Anonymous said...

This is hilarious. Even more so than the alleged "Indian cloud attack conspiracy" in (some) Pakistani minds :)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/from_our_own_correspondent/9110766.stm

Like it points out, (most of) Pakistan is in "simple denial", as articulated by Freud.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denial

That such "educated" journalists and editors did this speaks volumes about the national psyche.

Anonymous said...

@Bolshevik,
Your 'rant' tells a whole lot about you than any indian's supposedly condescending comments.
Try to travel abroad with your pakistani passport, and you'll know what the whole world thinks of Pakistanis.
Feel happy with India's problems, poverty, unrest and maoists. We know very well the problems we have. We have a system that may be slow, but its one that gives me hope that one day, may be after few decades from now on, these problems would be overcome. And that would be quite an achievement considering where and *when* we started.
Now tell us how many Pakistanis in their hearts think they have chance of seeing their country out of the mess they have in their lifetime or ever. The fact is that no one knows where your country is headed, not you, not your friends China and US , not your Arab masters. Thats the worst feeling a citizen would have. We have managed to survive and now thrive regardless of many religions, many castes among them and seemingly even what some would consider many races.
Besides a prayer, you have nothing to do and nothing to look forward to. Assuming you are in Pakistan. (Otherwise congratulation on getting out of Pakistan )

Ajax

TLW said...

Try to travel abroad with your pakistani passport

Thanks for offering, we already have.

you'll know what the whole world thinks of Pakistanis

They're actually very kind and polite to us to be honest.

how many Pakistanis in their hearts think they have chance of seeing their country out of the mess they have in their lifetime or ever

Ooh me! Me! Me! Me! Me! Me!

And two to four armies of Pakistani political activists! Who keep fighting everyday.


We'll be fine fuckwad. Just remember Ajax, that what comes out of *your* behind isn't vanilla and try not to eat it.

Ankur said...

Wow, TLW! Really classy!

Anonymous said...

http://www.fakingnews.com/2009/08/indian-terror-camps-in-balochistan-messed-up-in-corruption/

Harris said...

Finally a big mainstream media group acknowledges Cafe pyala for breaking this story. It's Dawn, incidently the only major Pak paper that did not run the fake Wikileaks story.

The article's by NFP.
http://www.dawn.com/2010/12/11/the-liars-collective.html

ExistentiallyYours said...

Get well soon TLW.

Ali said...

I wonder what happened to one of the alleged Giant Pakistani Media Dawn News because they have also hired Mr. Riffat Saeed alias Tooti as its Anchor, there is an FIR of attempted murder registered against him in Police Station Stattion Mubina Town Karachi [circa 1990], he is a Former Member of Thunder Squad and used to be in Editorial Board of Weekly Takbeer Karachi. By the way he is a Right Hand Man of Idrees Bakhtiar of BBC and Herald. Nowadays Riffat is Unofficial PRO of Rehman Malik.

Anonymous said...

could all you lot please stop with the pakistan-india slanging match already? i know there's only 3,421,384,477 other net forums where such retarded flame wars are raging and there's desperate need for another such battlefront of "wits", but please, not here. :P

Anonymous said...

Nice story, U r good at writing stories, Try in Bollywood you might get chance for a movie... any way all the best lol

hindu said...

islamic banana republic of pakistan
islamic al-taqiyya at its peak

AQ's Groupie said...

LOL! I suspect the AQ brigade is now pretending to be pak-bashing Indians and posting here.

These guys are nuts!

Anonymous said...

@TLW
Wot? Verbal Diarrhea ? Tsk Tsk...
Look up your dictionary..You'll find better words. Better than .. "Passive Aggressive"...

Abrams said...

While I am also guilty of having commented on this blog, I empathize with Bolshevik's opinion. Sadhana and Co, I guess what we need to understand is that most people who visit Cafe Pyaala are anyways Pakistani liberals, who clearly have no interest in blowing up Indians nor do they support their army's nefarious designs. These liberals are the only hope for Pakistan and from a distance it seems they are not many in number. They are themselves fighting bigots there and you make their task even more difficult by opening up a second front where they have to defend their motherland. Dont expect anybody to hear ill bout their country and not react. While I personally dont like the commies in the Indian context, I guess Pakistan desperately needs some Bolsheviks at least at this stage.

Mumra said...

LOL @ Aziz and @ Dawar
Bolshevik is right,
I am a Thundercats character.
In fact, I am the villian from Thundercats.
Me being at The News/Geo/Jang would be kinda weird.
But I do agree: boobies aren't "weird".

So, who the fuck are you again?

The Mindset said...

no wonder the Pakistanis beleive that 9/11 was done by Jews and 26/11 by Hindus.
"Conspiracy Theories" and muslims are best at cooking them