OMG. I don't think anyone could have done a better parody even if they had tried. I laughed so hard I almost cried. A Pakistan Tehrik-e-Insaf (PTI) supporter / activist presents his case to an Aaj TV cameraman. See this clip to understand why, as the title of the clip says, Imran Khan is doomed. (Thanks to Syed Ali Raza Abidi for the link.)
For those who do not understand the revolutionary Urdu slogans, here is a word-for-word translation of what Islamabad's Che Guevara says:
Or as they say, 'Agar ammi mana na karteen, tau inquilaab zaroor aata!'*
[*The Revolution would surely have happened, if only Mom had not said no.]
: : : UPDATES : : :
Zohair Toru, as we now know is the real name of our Islamabad Che, defends himself on Aaj TV's Bolta Pakistan tonight...
Part 1: You might want to watch the whole of this clip where Nusrat Javed explains the reason for inviting Zohair Toru on to the programme and presents different strands of his argument against the noveau-revolutionaries. But the actual bit with Toru begins around 10:15.
Part 2: The bit with Toru ends around 05:30, before which he brings up Che Guevara himself. Do not miss Nusrat Javed's response to that.
For those who do not understand the revolutionary Urdu slogans, here is a word-for-word translation of what Islamabad's Che Guevara says:
"See what is happening with our sisters and mothers in this demonstration. We are all from good families. We have come out on to the streets to raise slogans for Imran Khan. We are being beaten by our own police. They're pushing us. We have come for a revolution, for your country. Every person here has come out of his house for this. Who would do such demonstrations in such heat [otherwise]? The police is shoving us, for what? For a foreigner? For Raymond Davis? He caused such bloodshed in Lahore and ran away to his home. See what is happening with Afiya Siddiqui. Nobody has such justice. We have all come out on the streets. Our homes have curtains too. Our women also do purdah. But when revolution requires it, every person in the home comes out on the streets. [To off camera supporter] Am I lying? I'm saying the correct thing, right? Everyone comes out. Sir, look our own police is beating us, how can we bring about a revolution? You tell me, you're from the media. If you're with us, only then will the revolution come about. If the police don't beat us up, only then will the revolution come about. Now look at Imran Khan. What need does he have for this, he's a very rich man. He's standing up there on the stage and addressing people and even he is getting pushed around. Everyone's getting pushed left, right and centre. This brother here, he's totally sapped by the heat. Do we have any need of coming here?"
Or as they say, 'Agar ammi mana na karteen, tau inquilaab zaroor aata!'*
[*The Revolution would surely have happened, if only Mom had not said no.]
: : : UPDATES : : :
Zohair Toru, as we now know is the real name of our Islamabad Che, defends himself on Aaj TV's Bolta Pakistan tonight...
Part 1: You might want to watch the whole of this clip where Nusrat Javed explains the reason for inviting Zohair Toru on to the programme and presents different strands of his argument against the noveau-revolutionaries. But the actual bit with Toru begins around 10:15.
Part 2: The bit with Toru ends around 05:30, before which he brings up Che Guevara himself. Do not miss Nusrat Javed's response to that.
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86 comments:
Punda Chikna hai ;) - Yara Punday noon Taang na karo ....
I am willing to bet a fair amount he's from FAST-NU.
Yeah, he's an idiot. Javed Nusrat tweeted this first. Wow.
A lot of people were polite. I was going to ask if his (metaphorical) mother and sister had come out on the street inspite of the threat that as soon as they'ld leave purdah, they'ld be raped. He implied as much. What is happening with his mother(s) and sister(s) at this outdoor GT? Are they fighting off armies of potential molesters? Are they fending off the poondi-ing hordes of central Punjab? If his mother(s) and sister(s) are in such danger, maybe he should stop standing around making speeches like a queen and go help his family.
Seriously Cafe Pyala, the people who pollute our airwaves always have some parental issues lurking in the background. First those two ISI fishbaits and their dog litter families, now this pampered "revolutionary".
HAHA two thumbs up for the rainbow revolution!
Remember when Mao said "revolution is not a dinner party"? What would he say seeing this?
@Ahsan Mao said that???
Where were you when they were founding the Tehreek-e-Insaf?
That quote just dropped an H-Bomb on a lot of reactionary relatives gassing at us after dinner.
Thank You Mr Butt.
"ye mere bhai garmi main kharab hogaiy"
LMFAO!
TLW: I'd have to voice .'s concern here - I found your usage of the word "queen" quite derogatory. I might be misconstruing what you were trying to say by using that term, but with all due respect, I don't think you should throw such words around like that, even as a pun - it's just in really bad taste. Latent homophobia is also just homophobia at the end of the day - little puns and seemingly harmless jokes do affect a lot of people. I apologize for being preachy; your remark just really rubbed me off the wrong way.
I mean yaar it's true na? Not only do the cops push us around but even abuse us. In Punjabi! In front of my purdah nasheen mother, sister and my secret phone-sex girlfriend.
Musharraf offered our principled leader the prime ministership but he refused. Zia did the same but he refused.If Mullah Omar would offer him that post he would not refuse. Why doesn't Kayani do the same and kick off the revolutionary new govt yaar?
I mean, it only means rigging the results of Mianwali and 168 other NA seats and he could win. And wouldn't Afia Siddiqui make a better minister of state for foreign affairs than Hina Rabbani Khar? Altaf bhai just phoned to say that qaum ki beti would be the candidate for Baldia (Gharbi) if she returned. Can't Kayani sahib ask Altaf bhai to share his vote-stuffing tips and get rid of this lot? Then we can all have a proper revolution. Without the temperature rising further and the cops pushing us around any more.
And we will win the World Cup if only our great leader is leading the nation...
"Mere bhai garmi main kharab ho raha hain"- perfect end to an awesome video !
"Agar ammi mana na karteen, tau inquilaab zaroor aata!'"
Hey XYZ, are you NFP or Irfan Malik (DAWN), because this line I heard from their mouths many years ago.
What is sad and hilarious at the same time is that he is absolutely sincere. For someone who lives in the lap of complete luxury and privilege, the state and the police have always been something that he is above, something that he can navigate with ease. And now, those very lowly, nameless, invisible constables who would stand up straight and do salaami are daring to PUSH him, someone from a GOOD FAMILY! And that too, when he's out in the SUN!
Laugh, my friends, laugh. But after you finish chuckling, shed a metaphorical tear. Because this is how complete the elevation is from daily life, this is how separated he and his family are from Pakistan.
There's nothing personal about this, bechara Zohair is being absolutely sincere, because he knows no other reality.
And just in case you're wondering, for every Zohair in Pakistan, there are 10 others just like him in India.
the great inquilabi...
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100001409624759
he has been defending himself on facebook...lol
http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=1767495940832&oid=133988666668882&comments
This makes Imran Khan the sugar daddy of "revolution."
This kid needs to be giffted a lollipop. However, if it was left to me, I would have just slapped his cheeks and said, 'haram khor, go finish your homework first!'
"ladies and gentlemen, pakistans very own che gueverra . Immy K bitches"
he just got on to a whole new level of coolness and revolutionaries! Long live "Immy K bitches" and Kim Kardashian!
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=143924568997863&set=a.111380155585638.12938.100001409624759&theater
Excellent post. The translation is good too, but "Our homes have curtains too" is plain and simple wrong. It is too literal and does not convey the meaning properly. XYZ, the nitpicker, consider this: "We (or Our household members) observe purdah too".
Okay someone needs to flag these comments immediately!! The video was one thing... You guys are really crossing the line by disrespecting someone's privacy.
The Revolutionary face of Pakistan! If this bunch is plotting 'Inqilab' then we are safe forever. As the old Punjabi saying goes 'Pukhay nay pukhay de maari, duwaan nu ghash paay giya'!
if there is one lesson to be learned here, it is surely "restrict your facebook profile before stepping out for an inqalab"
LOL you couldn't resist "the curtains" could you?
As much mummy daddy this kid may be, it is ironic that key board warriors and 'intellectual critics' sitting in their bed rooms are making fun of this kid who at least has some moral clarity that he is protesting against Davis whereas XYZ and other people on this blog used convoluted logic to make a case for Davis.
Hahah, hilarious though this is, it is in fact a credit to Imran Khan that he's pushed burgers to protest under the sun and get pushed around by big bad policemen.
No story can ever top this story
Folks,
as @Zoya Rehman has pointed out to @TLW, there is no reason that your comments should stoop to stereotyping and homophobia. All further comments in that vein will be removed.
@Anon316 and @Gul: Yes, I couldn't resist the curtains bit. It was tongue in cheek :) Technically my translation is correct even though we may understand that it was a flub on the boy's part. "Humaray gharon mein bhi parday hain" is hardly the right way to say "our households observes purdah too." In any case he corrects himself in the next sentence.
@RedRum: It's a well known phrase among leftie circles.
@Kashaan Ahmed: @kona berwalla is right. There is nothing on here that is not publicly available.
@Anon429: Aap ko aap ki "moral clarity" ka concept mubarak ho.
While I understand the video's funny, here's a thought. Would you prefer an unruly mob - burning, looting, possibly armed or throwing stones at the police? His aim of revolution might not be met, but since when did wanting the ability to conduct a peaceful political protest without being beaten up by the police become a sign of weakness?
I don't understand what is at all funny about this. The guy is trying to make a difference, unlike the rest of us sitting in front of our computer screens in air-conditioned rooms. I would like to see anyone criticizing the man explain what they have DONE that is better/more beneficial than this.
"Our homes have curtains too."
That sir, is a masterstroke of translation....
@XYZ
nahi jinaab ab hoga, but kindly check with NFP. NFP and Irfan Malik wrote a satirical poem back in I think late 1980s where they used this and i remember NFP first used it for a leftie comrade of his from college.
Clarifies the term 'burger jihadis'.
Inqalabi/Imran Khan Supporter Meme
http://i.imgur.com/DIPHo.jpg
Imran Khan Supporter Meme
what's the point of posting this video? to show how disconnected some of us are with reality or to make fun of his personality just for the fun of it?
I believe we are too much limited by our concept of revolution. there can be many roads to revolution and his might be one even if we think he is asking for the moon when complaining about police and heat when his goal is to bring a revolution.
Anyways we love to get personal and make others target of our crude and merciless humor.
ok i think i should step down from the pulpit now. next preaching next time!
I honestly feel bad for the guy. This kind of mockery has gone a bit too far now especially considering the fact that he was totally sincere while giving his little speech. And well, he was out there wasn't he? If anything, the video highlights the misconceptions the privileged youth of Pakistan holds about a "revolution" or a possible solution to the country's problems. It's an issue that deserves to be addressed in a more serious manner and not under the guise of cruel commentary which lacks any insight. We are already suffering because of the disinterest of the "elite" or "almost-elite" in political affairs and this kind of attitude is not going to really help things. Correct them, don't mock them.
-Juhi
This post is not for making fun of the mannerism of the guy. Rather, it highlights just how flawed the concept of bringing an "inqilab" is. We already have a democratically elected government. True, the country is facing some of the worst times ever, but do you honestly believe that the world on the whole is a hunky dory place at the moment? Pseudo-revolutionaries like Imran Khan are nothing more than rhetorical masters; chanting the same slogans of "ghairat", "Amreeka kay ghulaam'and still in a state of denial about terrorists being our own created Frankensteins. All the media hogwash about the government failing on different levels is motivated by political vendetta. Anyone remember these same people screaming about democracy during the times of Musharraf? The government isn't there to fulfill your wish-list child. If you don't like their policies, there's a democratic process to replace them, whatever flaws the system has. And it's ironic how these people are chanting the slogans of getting inspired by the recent Middle East crisis. Egypt, Tunisia and Libya were under the control of autocratic governments, which is exactly the opposite case in Pakistan. Weren't we the first Muslim country ever who bought about such a revolution several years ago? Anyone remember the unrest during the later years of Ayub Khan's rule?
We have indeed turned into a nation living in its own bubble. Our holier than thou attitude shall lead us nowhere. Wake up people. Start questioning things around you, instead of swallowing everything which is being barked out about how the world is against us, about how the country is in a "nazukh stage" in its history, about how we are failing at every goddamn level.
@usmankhaliq you sound like NFP. are you NFP. not that it matters. just curious.
ALL is NFP. NFP is ALL. And if it isn't, it will be. Because we must all find the NFP within us. Only through the inner NFP will we find peace.
May the NFP be with you
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=196697430364126&set=a.196697427030793.46406.160749293958940&ref=nf
YEH WOH LARKA HAI JO DHOOP MEIN KHARAB HUA HAI!!
NFP is God! Or maybe God is NFP. Either way he is the reason why all secularists will end up in Paradise! :)
See you there comrades.
While you are having a belly laugh at the expense of the simpleton in the video, spare a thought for the destruction of China's established order - their very own equivalent of our Brown Sahibs and Memsahibs - in the nineteen sixtees and seventees. The Chinese economic miracle came in the wake of that terrible Cultural Revolution.
That bloke in the video, and thousands of other emotionally driven boys and girls, may have the last laugh unless Pakistan's privileged class reforms itself. Guess who wrote the following lines?
اٹھو میری دنیا کے غریبوں کو جگا دو
کاخ امرا کے در و دیوار ہلا دو
جس کھیت سے دہقاں کو میسّر نہ ہو روزی
اس کھیت کے ہر خوشہ گندم کو جلا دو
Habib Jalib? No, it was Iqbal.
@Sakib Ahmed
You say: "That bloke in the video, and thousands of other emotionally driven boys and girls, may have the last laugh unless Pakistan's privileged class reforms itself"
First of all, you sound some of those ex-maoists who once joined Imran (but then got the fuck out).
Secondly, bhai jaan, this simpleton IS the elite!!
You're out operating well outside the ironic joke hear. Sheesh.
@Lufunga ooye Lufungay, xyz can't be NFP. xyz sounds younger, NFP is kind of old. moreover, xyz doesn't seem that much inclined to defend zardari or ppp though he/she doesn't seem to criticize them that much.
xyz doesn't have that humor and wit that nfp has. if nfp had been xyz then we could have recognized the similarities in writings or themes. i haven't noticed any obvious similarities.
Always thought Imran and his fans were delusional, but not this stupid.
Stupid AND delusional. Toba hai.
@Nangyal
Hmmm. You have a point, but most I talk to about Pyala believe that NFP is behind this site, along with Muhammad Hanif. Great blog nevertheless.
@TLW: Right on dude! You showed them! Only you have the guts to comment anonymously against the rightist forces and the GHQ!
By shouting out a big fuck you to all these people, TLW has upped the ante and changed the game. I wonder how the establishment will react to this?
Someday, the world will be a better place because of TLW's use of the F-word!
Bravo, hats off to your edgy valour, sir! Because that's what it takes to destroy the Ts. Swear words on blogs.
P.S: TLW, sift through the ideology - btw, I'm on "your" side of the divide - you don't know how much you're like this Toru kid. You're actually making fun of yourself. This is an Escher-loop.
Whatever you have to say or think about this kid, his purpose has been served. Nobody will ever think about revolutions or inqalaab in this country ever again.
This a really sad blog. Atleast he's trying, right? What're you doing for your country? Writing a blog about how a kid freaked out in front of a live camera and said some stupid stuff? Its because of Pakistanis like you that a revolution is out of the question now, not Zohair Toru.
Anon 11:14
This is tiredness speaking. I really don't give a damn. And at least I have the sense to say my politically profound nothings behind an anonymous name; unlike that PTI kid with near zero self awareness. If I unintentionally amuse you, forgive me oh commander of the Baloch Liberation Forces. You're writing in English on the internet from Pakistan. You and I are part of the group that is benefitting from the system. So please don't lecture me about similarities.
Its been two decades plus living in Karachi and the corpses keep piling up here, and now upcountry as well. The rate of murder doesn't seem to fall, only stabilise or accelerate. Ideology is little use in front of a bunch of gun toting thugs. And those thugs have been busy over the last three months. And excuse me but we're all tired of it. Toru is a symptom of the ugliness, and its going to get uglier if our rightwing has about as much control of its malformed impulses as Mr Toru has of his malformed thoughts.
Anon @3:15 said
"Its because of Pakistanis like you (Cafe Pyala) that a revolution is out of the question now"
How can people like you assume that everybody in this country wants a revolution?
Bhai, first understand what a revolution means, or more importantly, what it means in the context of Pakistan, and whine about how spoil-sports like Pyala are stopping it from happening.
Stop spreading Imran Khan's core revolutionary ideology which from now on should be called: Toruism.
Just 3000 people attended Imran's rally, it proves that Raymond is an absolute non-issue for the masses. Nobody talks about the real problems of poverty, inflation, disease etc; I am sure these 'Immy K Bitches' wont attend a rally for such not so sexy issues. Only a full stomach can think of foreign policy and Qaumi ghairat.
Anonymous@Magnum
Tell me your idea of a revolution then Magnum. You think we dont need a revolution? While you are probably happy in your middle class family with your above average standard of living and moderate education, there are a 100 million people who can't make enough money for food, education and shelter. I dont know why you haven't realized (im guessing daddy still pays for your shit) but inflation in Pakistan is currently almost 20%. Remember those times when a roti was for 4 Rs? While you can probably afford a roti for twice the price now, others cant. Zohair might not have the right words to express his feelings but he tried to speak up for our poverty stricken people. If you can get over his westernized attire and choice of words, please appreciate his effort. Thank you
To anonymous 5:06:
A revolution is definitely not the answer to our economic problems; in fact, the turmoil brought about a revolution is only going to make situations worse. Remember how Egypt's stock market dropped during the revolts? At this point in time, Pakistan is a functioning democracy. Issues regarding food, education, shelter are the government's responsibility and if the democratic system remains functional in this country then the current government will pay for its neglect in the next elections. Democracy is a process; let us please just try to wait it out.
At this point, let's just try to retain some semblance of sanity and humanity amidst all that is going on in this country. And making fun of Toru this way doesn't seem to be really humane (Not commenting on Cafe Pyala but the general Pakistani internet user).
-Juhi
Yes, Pakistan has a democracy of sorts where the list of voters contains over 35 million bogus names! Certainly, we can and we must do all we can to strengthen our infant democracy. To save time, I'll just repeat what I have said elsewhere:
" We form our opinions on facts as we observe them, and our subjective judgments may differ. The reason I consider our democracy to be a fake system is because of the hidden powers which operate behind the scenes. Take the last election held in 2008. This lacked legitimacy because of the huge part played by the Americans behind the scenes, resulting in the rotten NRO, the brain child of Condoleezza Rice. Subsequently, the Americans held the Pakistani politicians in the palms of their hands as the WikiLeaks revelations have made abundantly clear.
An excellent article was published in ‘Jang’ today about the worthlessness of the 2008 election. This article, too, appears to be arguing for fresh elections NOW – something I have been advocating for some time.
The link to the ‘Jang’ article is:
http://www.jang.com.pk/jang/mar2011-daily/12-03-2011/col1.htm"
Don't know about this democracy, Sakib, but one thing is certainly worthless in Pakistan and that is Jang Group.
cafepyala never sounded so cheap...making fun of anyone is easy, easy indeed. FU CP
ok, why don't you come out and raise your voice against whatever wrong is happening. Writing blog is quite easy especially when you just copy paste links.
I've always respected this blog and enjoyed reading it, but I sadly disagree with your stifling views on this matter.
Yes, the video is hilarious, i can't stop laughing, but I for one commend this youngster for coming on to the streets, despite his sometimes poor choice of words. People moan and complain about the divide between the rich and poor in Pakistan, and this individual is simply a product of that rift. Yet when one of the individuals from the richer segments of society steps out, with all their differences in behaviours and views, asking for change, this is the reception he gets? If you think this kid is unique in how he talks, maybe you guys haven't seen the general crop of kids from about 6th grade to a levels recently. THEY ALL SOUND LIKE THIS.
Is that what all these blogs and tweets and calls for change are about? some kind of redemption for our inaction and malaise? Oh yeah, we didn't go on to the streets, but f**k yeah we wrote a whole lotta words and sure inspired some of those people that got shot. its a cop out.
Sure, point out the humour in this, I won't deny there are some awesome nuggets in there, but please don't be so negative. What is the example you're setting here? if you're different we'll mock you?? If you're not an arm chair politician, then we'll mock you? Its easy to hide behind a screen, much tougher to go out there. Sure it was only 300 people, but every single minute they were outside, we were all sitting in our comfy chairs indoors hoping for someone else to bring revolution.
we were all sitting in our comfy chairs indoors hoping for someone else to bring revolution.
I don't want a revolution. Just the head of Qari Hussain Ahmed on a platter.
That is actually what I want. For the domestic sectarian terorist networks in Pakistan to be wrapped up. For the tax Rupees, and the US citizens aid, paid from American's taxes, to be put to the use they are paid for. An acheiveable goal. A measurable goal. Not an open ended brand called 'revolution'.
Inquilaab Murdabad
All those wonderful things you mention, that you make out to be so easy, are in fact agreeably very easy, but implementation has always been the problem. Do you think nawaz zardari the military and co read these blogs and comments? Do you think they don't know what the problems are? Do you think they are just going to fix themselves, just like that?? How doyou plan to engag them in this dialogue, the opposition you elect and everybody you give a vote to that is part of the majority or not, has a responsibility to enforce these good governance rules. Are they helping you? Do you think they're just lazy?? Do you think none of them really have any idea about the suicide bombings andnthe money being squandered and the lost tax revenue? Yeah you must be delusion if you think we live in a country where people just do the right thing because their conscience tells them to. The pleople might, but your politicians certainly are not guided by any conscience you or I might understand.
So the point of these calls for revolution isn't to bring a blood bath. Its not to wage some kind of guerella warfare againstt the government. It's not to kill them. It's to make the politicians see that the people are finally sick of this. That the people will not take this anymore. That these aren't the same people from 20 years ago that you could appease so easily. These people now have access to information and independently educate themselves over the Internet and teach each other the things they are supposed to learn in schools that you never build them. THAT is the point of this to me.
Wake up pakistanis. As long as you're sleeping you can't expect the conscience of the politicians to be awake. They must be forced to be awoken from their comfortable slumbers.
we were all sitting in our comfy chairs indoors hoping for someone else to bring revolution
Ya revolution led by Imran Khan, Munawar Hassan and Hafiz Saeed! Do these revolutionaries know what is the role of military establishment in Pakistan?
cafe pyala and all those who are making fun of the guy, you ppl are despicable. it is very easy to make fun of him but have you ever though how painful it would be to this person. you sure can talk about the naivety of our youth but continually make references to his personality and calling him che and all that is pretty low.
are you all perfect? hope one day you are one day caught with you pants down.
I feel sorry for the society that is producing such youth. shame on you all. i hate this media too. one can suddenly find onself a butt of ridicule.
This made me decide to comment on this blog again:
"It's to make the politicians see that the people are finally sick of this."
Here's a hint, bhaijaan. There exists a way for people to show the government that they are sick of things. And that is, in the words of a famous widower, that, "Democracy is the best revenge." The only thing that you guys should be agitating about is the Election Commission of Pakistan. Start a nationwide campaign for THAT to become robust. Once that is sorted out, everything else will fall in line. Once Zardari gets drummed out of office in a free election, and, more importantly, once honest parliamentarians get re-elected, the path of parliamentary democracy gets clear. You don't have to look very far to see the examples. When the Congress defeated the BJP once, everyone was shocked. And they were shocked again when they defeated the BJP again because the masses supported them. Similarly, when the Janata Dal defeated Laloo Yadav in Bihar, people were shocked. When they won a 4/5ths majority in Bihar the second time around, they were flabbergasted. If Bihar, of all states, can reward electoral competence then any state can.
The one thing you guys have tried is the saviour on a horseback. You've done it time and time again. Benazir and Nawaz both benefited from that. Ayub, Zia, Musharraf... all of them were "saviours" who the street welcomed at first. I remember reading how you guys were distributing laddoos on the streets when Musharraf came to power.
The only thing you guys haven't tried is a democratic government completing its term as it should. That's the one freakin thing you haven't tried. FFS.
Aniruddha Shankar said...
This made me decide to comment on this blog again:
"It's to make the politicians see that the people are finally sick of this."
Here's a hint, bhaijaan. There exists a way for people to show the government that they are sick of things. And that is, in the words of a famous widower, that, "Democracy is the best revenge." The only thing that you guys should be agitating about is the Election Commission of Pakistan....."
Wow you must be delusional to the point of no return. When have the powerful willingly given up their seats of power? The game in the subcontinent, and specifically pakistan, is do as little for the people, fill your pockets as much as possible as quickly as possible, and leave. Conducting free and fair elections setting up NAB properly, etc is like axing their own feet. huge conflict of interest, not going to happen voluntarily.
Democracy works in the west, and they had to struggle for it. The strong always rule over the weak, the stronger are the weak, the weaker are the strong. The imbalance will always be there but you can narrow the gap. Through out our history we have complained about injustice, dictatorships, lack of sovereignty, but we've still felt helpless facing politicians. I think its important for the majority to come out and tell the governments that they wont stand for this anymore.
Im not saying vote for imran kham, infact that might not be as great an idea as otehrs think, but the choices are limited. We have to stick with our current politicians, nawaz, zardari, who ever, because theres nobody else, but we have to tell them they have to fix themselves and its time to give something back to the country. And while we try to get back form the politicians some semblance of decent governance, ouor next generation of politicians can be cultivated. Hopefully they won't be part of the ruling elite only, or the landlords, or the excessively wealthy. But right now, if you're expecting some leadership to emerge from your villages, and the common people, you are mistaken.
One of the first times I have been disappointed with the way you have presented a topic! I dont understand why everybody is after his life.. Although he talks about Davis hee wants a general change and has come out on the street, and whats more is that he has a middle class background.. his effort should be appreciated.. everybody can talk on a dining table about what should happen, bla dee bla dee blaa but the point is that this young man has gone out and taken a stand.. and for that matter Cafe Pyala can write anything and the users can write anything but change is not 'just' going to come through words!
Wow you must be delusional to the point of no return. When have the powerful willingly given up their seats of power?
Happens all the time, man. Just across the border. Happens (to an extent) even in Pakistan, see the (generally considered fair) last elections that Mush presided over in which his PML(Q) lost. What do you call that?
Conducting free and fair elections setting up NAB properly, etc is like axing their own feet. huge conflict of interest, not going to happen voluntarily.
Well, not if most of those opposed to the government (which includes people like Mr. Toru) spend all their time a willing pawn of the establishment, protesting things from Aafia to Davis.
Democracy works in the west, and they had to struggle for it.
... and you're saying you shouldn't struggle for it? That without struggling for democracy to work, a perfectly functional system will fall into your lap?
I'm not sure what you're trying to say. Are you for inquilab / revolution? Or are you for protesting against the excesses of the government and kicking them out in the next election?
All i'm trying to say man is that in Pakistan, just because you vote for someone doesn't mean they will fulfill their fiduciary duty completely. Haath per marnay partay hain to get them to do what you want. I'm not necessarily for the kind of revolution people are screaming for out of political self-interest, but I am for peaceful protest. I am totally for people coming on to the streets to make it obvious to the politicians in power that they will no longer stand for empty promises made to get votes. That something has to be done to shake up the status quo. The power of the mob is sometimes necessary. Our current politicians were elected fairly, yes, but since then, what have they fixed? i'm not talking about short term things like Ramond Davis, I'm talking about the things the government CAN do in the bigger picture, to fix the system, to give poeople justice, to have an economic plan in place to attract foreign capital and to build the economy organically in the country, to promote peace with our neighbour (which the military strongly apposes), to alleviate the pain of the powerless and the hungry. Those are much easier things to do than participating in the war on terror for example. they are things they HAVE the power to accomplish. But they aren't even trying. And before you say easier said than done, yes i know rome wasn't built in a day, but someone laid a foundation. Who is laying that foundation for us?? yes, the courts are fair at the top of the system, but even they make a decision, and and are then powerless to execute it because the police force is not subservient to the courts but to the person who put them in that position.
Watch zardari's past 3 speeches to parliament prior to the one yesterday. Count the number of promises he made, and then count the ones that have been fulfilled. I am saying that protest, whether its from imran khan, or this burger boy, or from your common man that washes dishes, is necessary to tell the self interested politicians that the disenfranchised have nothing else to lose and if steps are not taken to fix things, there will be a day of reckoning.
@Reding
Sorry, I do not see why Jang Group is worthless. If you are not just making an accusation out of spite, would you care to offer an explanation? In my book any newspaper which provides space for journalists of the calibre of Haroon-ur-Rasheed, Saleem Safi and Dr Safdar Mahmood is quite valuable.
An example of a pretty worthless publication is the Express Tribune, which exists to defend the USA government’s policies and to sell them to Pakistan’s Brown Sahibs and Brown Memsahibs. I have written at some length about my experience at the ET – see the section headed ‘A Trojan horse in Pakistan’ in this blog post:
http://sakibahmad.blogspot.com/2011/02/fall-of-american-empire.html
In the comments at the end of the current blog post you will find further references to ET and its target readership of westernised Pakistanis.
One basic fundamental fact is being missed by all concerned. If Pakistanis go to other countries to impose punishment on them, people of those countries will come to Pakistan to impose punishment on Pakistanis in return.
At least Americans didn't hijack a airplane full of Pakistanis to get Raymond Davis back, like Pakistanis hijacked a planeful of Indians for get back Omar Sheikh who was in an Indian prison for murder and kidnapping.
-Sadhana
@Sakib
The topic of your article "fall of american empire" suggests your immaturity and poor understanding of global politics.
Haroon Rasheed is the mouthpiece of GHQ. He took money from ISI and wrote a book on the famous drug smuggler General Akhtar Abdur Rehman.
Saleem Safi, the poor guy often admits how we was stupid enough to fight in the CIA sponsored Afghan jihad while Mullah Military alliance bagged billions in US aid and Jihadi funds. And how the US later threw us away like a used condom after the Soviet exit.
And read any book other than Punjab textbook board rubbish on Pak studies; you will realize how shallow Safdar Mehmood's knowledge of Pak History is.
You dont even know that the main benificiary of Pak-US relations is the army and ISI. You have been fooled over Raymond issue by the army, not the brown sahibs. Only army can be sick enough to use islamic laws to enable his release. And Drone attacks are carried by the approval of GHQ. You are stuck in these blogs/newspapers who have no influnce on Pak-US relations. Study the modus operandi of GHQ, you will realize how comprehensively you have been decieved by the pro-military intelligensia, the Haroon Rasheed types.
Excellent post, Anon@ 9:25.
Sakib seems intelligent enough to understand the other side of the story. But, unfortunately, the Torus of this republic will forever remain blissfully stupid.
@Sakib
You live in UK!....LMAO
Anonymouses!
It aint much fun talking to masked persons. Do you think merely stating the obvious - something that everyone knows after the long, long years of Zia and Musharraf – will turn pen pushers into informed individuals who can write intelligently?
Firstly, let me disabuse you of some notions you harbour about me. Do read the following blogs to learn about the reality of the army and its sidekick, the ISI:
http://sakibahmad.blogspot.com/2010/02/case-of-missing-persons.html
http://sakibahmad.blogspot.com/2010/12/anne-patterson-queen-of-pakistan.html
The one difference between you and me is that you have been conditioned into criticising your own institutions while turning a blind eye to the atrocities committed by the American armed forces and the CIA. Would that westernised Pakistanis were capable of seeing the beam in their masters’ eyes! Most patriotic Pakistanis can see very clearly what is wrong with their institutions, and they do criticise them but not to the point of trying to destroy them – which is what a lot of Brown Sahibs and Brown Memsahibs do.
Secondly, you make some laughable comments about Haroon-ur-Rasheed and Saleem Safi. These two graduated from the University of Life, which is beyond the comprehension of clever-clever softies sitting in their drawing rooms. One learns through making mistakes and one’s ideas evolve non-stop. Saleem Safi is one of those rare people who have made mistakes and learnt from them, a painful process which, again, is beyond the comprehension of drawing room analysts.
Your remarks about Haroon-ur-Rasheed reflect your ignorance and prejudice. If you were a reader of his columns you would know that he has the ear of Ashfaq Kayani, who does get get hurt when Haroon criticises him harshly – which he did after the WikiLeaks revelations. If anything, Haroon is the conscience of the Army and he has earned its respect. It is a great pity that westernised Pakistanis are so full of prejudice against Urdu newspapers that they prefer trash like ‘the Trojan horse’ ET and 'that insult to Quaid-e-Azam’s memory', Dawn.
What the Army/ISI has done in the case of Davis has greatly weakened its position. I think that the Davis fiasco may have been a blessing in disguise as it has opened up people's eyes to the chicanery and intrigue of our Brown Sahibs who dominate the army, the government, the judiciary and the civil service. This much ought to have been obvious to you if you had read my blogs to understand what my point of view is. But you seem to have skim read them just so you can hurl ill-formed accusations at me.
Most of your articles are about 'national honour' although you are a British national! I think you dont realize how lame this is.
So you ignored the main argument i made: army is the main beneficiary of Pak US relations. Foreign policy is a reflection of inner strength; it’s not the other way around. If you hate US policies vis a vis Pakistan, then you should blame the army for that.
Army has turned Pakistan into a security state for its own narrow institutional interests. Our army comprised of mercenaries, who were saluting the Union jack until 13 March, 1947; they have nothing to do with Jinnah. It sent poor tribals into Kashmir and while they were being strafed by Indian airplanes, our GHQ refused to send any regular troops. It was beginning of the long list of shameful acts committed by our army. Army maintains preeminence in the share of national resources by invoking imaginary external threats. And to counter those imaginary threats, it gets a huge share in the budget and relies on external powers like US. It entered the shameful SEATO CENTO and earned billion of dollars. Ayub destroyed Muslim league, laid the foundations of Dhaka fall, launched military operations against Balochs. Ayub started the 1965 war and lost. His successor presided over the breakup of Pakistan. Zia, the murderer of thousands of Palestinians, again derailed democracy by US approval. He took Pakistan into the killing fields of Afghanistan. He indoctrinated thousands of children of poor families and had them killed in Afghanistan. While generals and officers partied in their cantonments, these poor children got blown in the minefields of Afghanistan. Zia deliberately provoked sectarian differences to attain political goals. His non-party elections laid the foundations of patronage politics. He turned a stable society into a battlefield of violent extremist groups. Fortunately Zia died, but our misery never ended. Hamid gul opened up jihadi and sectarian madrassas in the heart of Punjab to launch his so called Kashmir Jihad. ISI played the dirty role of dismissing democratic regimes. In 1999, Musharraf had us humiliated in Kargil and enacted a shameful coup when Nawaz wanted to remove him. In 2001, our mercenary generals heaved a sigh of relief when US asked their help in return for dollars. Besides these calamities, our army is the largest land owner of the country, our generals are involved in drug smuggling and land grabbing; AWT, NLC are all sources of income for retired generals. Our army revolves around money, whether its taxpayers money, US dollars or jihadi petrodollars.
What has newspapers or blogs to do with national policy? How can you compare a private person with institutions of the state? I can only sympathize at your ignorance and naivety, for comparing newspapers with the army.
I'm a new reader so excuse my lack of know-how about this place but homophobia is not tolerated? Seriously? For someone using the word 'queen'?
Since when has homosexuality become acceptable? I would argue against it but it seems pointless as my comment will likely get "moderated".
Finally I found the 'post comment' link.
I would say police beat people probably because they were told to, or they were forced to somehow. It is the person that stands behind people need to find out.
@Anon: That's flawed reasoning.
But let's go along with what you said. Did the muslims of the subcontinent see homosexuality in a positive light? Do you argue that they did? Is it not likely that his positives outweighed the negatives (like homosexuality)? And is it not even more likely that they had no choice in the matter since...oh yeah the elections were rigged weren't they?
@Ammar
I want to make a single argument: Homosexuality is a non issue. Thats it. Nobody has the time to worry about personal habits of others.
And there I'll agree with you.
بنام نقاب پوش نمبر ٢
یا رب وہ نہ سمجھے ہیں نہ سمجھیں گے مری بات
دے اور دل ان کو جو نہ دے مجھ کو زباں اور
کیا آپ اس حقیقت سے واقف نہیں کہ پاکستانی لاکھوں کی تعداد میں وطن عزیز سے باہر زندگی گزار رہے ہیں؟ زر مبادلہ کی وہ رقوم جو یہ لوگ ہر سال وطن بھیجتے ہیں پاکستانی معیشت میں ریڑھ کی ہڈی کی حثیت رکھتی ہیں
وطن چھوڑنے والوں میں زیادہ تر وہ لوگ ہوتے ہیں جو پاکستان میں اپنے مستقبل سے مایوس ہو کر کہیں اور قسمت آزمائی کے لئے نکل کھڑے ہوتے ہیں- میں جب تک پاکستان میں رہا انگریزی زبان میرے پلے نہیں پڑی- انگلستان آنے کے بعد مجھے یہ زبان سیکھنے میں بہت مدد ملی اور اب میں اس بدیشی زبان کو بخوبی استعمال کرنا سیکھ گیا ہوں- پاکستان میں براؤن صاحبوں کی بدولت پاکستان کی ذہانت مٹی میں مل کے تباہ ہو رہی ہے کیونکہ اردو میں اپنی ذہانت کا اظہار کرنے والے کو نظر انداز کر دیا جاتا ہے- امیر گھرانوں کے خر دماغ فرزند بڑے بڑے عھدوں پہ محض اس وجہ سے متمکن ہیں کہ انہیں کسی نہ کسی طرح انگرزی زبان سکھا دی گئی ہے- براؤن صاحبوں کے اس احساس کمتری کے نتیجے میں پاکستان میں ہر سو ناانصافی' غربت اور جہالت پھیلی ہوئی ہے- میں نے اس موضوع پہ ایک مضمون لکھا تھا جو آپ یہاں پڑھ سکتے ہیں
http://sakibahmad.blogspot.com/2010/01/punjab-governments-own-goal.html
نقاب پوش، طنز کے تیر مارنے سے پہلے اتنی تو جرات دکھائی ہوتی کہ اپنا چہرہ عریاں کر دیتے! میں برطانوی پاکستانی ہوں اور اس کے متعلق میں اپنے بلاگ میں لکھ چکا ہوں- ذیل کے رابطے کو دبا کر آپ بھی بآسانی پڑھ سکتے ہیں
http://sakibahmad.blogspot.com/2010/05/british-general-election-6-may-2010.html
میرا اولین پیار پاکستان اور اردو کے ساتھ ہے، انگیزی اور برطانیہ تو بہت بعد میں آے اور ان کی حیثیت ثانوی ہے - امید ہے آپ بات سمجھ گئے ہوں گے- اگر نہیں سمجھے تو میں یہی کہہ سکتا ہوں کہ
ایک زمانے سے ہے چاک گریباں مرا
تو ہے ابھی ہوش میں، میرے جنوں کا قصور
@ Nangyal. No man, I am obviously not NFP( although I am an ardent fan of his works). Just a young Pakistani still trying to figure out what to do in life.
Granted that Zuhair is naive and completely lacking in self-awareness, especially as it relates to his own privilege. Agreed that Zuhair's loyalty to Imran Khan is misguided, and accepted that his suggestion the Khan is like Che Guevara is patently absurd. But, the truth is that unlike many secular liberals in Pakistan, at least Zuhair is on the right side of the political issue. I have heard countless friends and colleagues, not to mention commenters on this blog, suggest that the Raymond Davis issue received unwarranted media hype. Often, this is contrasted with the way the mainstream media treats Islamic extremism, and specifically the murders of Salman Taseer and Shahbaz Bhatti. The truth is that the vast majority of secular liberals in Pakistan see these as mutually exclusive issues, and they claim that we should focus on the rise of the radical right here and not on American imperialism, almost always failing to see the connection between these things. Sadly, Pakistani liberals are too obsessed with the mythical figure of the "mullah" and too obsessed with rejecting the arguments of the "ghairat brigade" to really understand what propels Islamic extremism in this country. By dismissing these issues, they thrust Pakistan deeper and deeper into the hands of the violent fringe. People like Zuhair, for all their faults, at least show that one does not have to be a member of the Jamaat-ud-Dawa to find American imperialism to be morally repugnant.
I am sure that Zuhair must be feeling a bit awkward with the reception this post has received. And to be very, very frank - this one is quite funny. However I think you can be a pretty good speaker. You do not lack the confidence - for one. And you have the ability to display the emotions while speaking. Only in this post you taken the tone of a pleading child - while talking about revolution!
I do not look like you. My background and political ideologies (in fact even country) is different. I do admire Imran Khan's courage - but hate him for the 1992. Still I think - at some stage - I do sound like you. When I started taking part in debates - lots of people made fun of me. I ended up being a fairly good university level debater.
Best of luck...
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